In what we're doing now, we are getting to a feel of the world that is neither organic
 nor mechanical.
 Simply what it is.
 We don't, again, we don't know the contrast, just as we don't know the contrast voluntary-involuntary,
 we don't know the contrast organic-mechanical.
 Neither.
 So we get to what the Buddhists call tathata suchness.
 Tathata, based on the word tat, that, da.
 Fundamentally dada.
 See?
 Dada, dada, dada, dada, that's what's going on.
 Well now this is what happens, you see, in the meditative state.
 As you are in that, you see, everything is da.
 And you're not saying anymore, well that doesn't amount to anything.
 Because you've learned that when people do take you to the place that does amount to
 something, eventually it all collapses.
 The price of being taken to the place seriously, you see, where it really does amount to something,
 this at last is the real thing.
 The price you pay for that, you see, is the horrors about its opposite.
 And to the degree that you take that seriously, okay, you pay the price of the horrors.
 Now that's as a matter of fact all.
 So I'm not saying that you shouldn't take it seriously, I mean, to be specific, you
 are tremendously in love with someone.
 And you plan and plan and plan how possibly you can get this person to return your love.
 And they do.
 And this is the great event.
 This is fantastic.
 But the background of your mind is the thought that what if this person should be killed
 or some terrible thing happened.
 That always lurks behind the triumph of getting it so, of this intense, gorgeous feeling.
 Now if you know that this is in a way an illusion, you can allow yourself to take it quite seriously.
 But always having a hint of gedanke, a reservation, a thought, way back, this is the game.
 And having that, as a matter of fact, you can take it seriously, you can allow yourself
 to get involved in life to the most ridiculous degree.
 Because you know it's all right.
 It's just these vibrations.
 And so wowee, let's really get into it.
 That is why a person who might be enlightened, a bodhisattva, does not always present a kind
 of detached and indifferent attitude.
 But is perfectly free to allow emotions, attachments.
 Why R.H.
 Blythe, who was a great Zen man, wrote me once and said, "How are you these days?
 As for me, I have abandoned satori altogether and I'm trying to become as deeply attached
 as I can to as many people and things as possible."
 So what I'm pointing out to you is that this basic seeing that it's all da, da, da, provides
 a possibility for you to become involved in it much more incautiously than you normally
 are.
 To express feeling, to love, to throw yourself at the mercy of the goings on completely,
 you see.
 So that this very perception of the illusion makes it possible to live up the illusion.
 And so if someone therefore is always in his attitude to life detached and reserved, it
 indicates, you see, that there's still a primordial fear of getting involved.
 And I must say that, you see, I can't understand that very well.
 I don't understand what people expect that a so-called enlightened person should not
 need this, that, and the other.
 It might be beautiful surroundings, it might be the love of the opposite sex, it might
 be I don't know what.
 You shouldn't need that.
 In other words, you should scrub everything down to basic, basic.
 And the end of that is, you know, let's scrub the planet, let's get all this disease called
 life off it and have a nice clean rock.
 I believe in color, I believe in if you're going to do anything in the way of the illusory
 dance, let's live it up, let's really do it.
 And let's not be... take ourselves so damn seriously that we have to be scrubbed all
 the time of any kind of ornamentation or frivolity.
 Oh, hooray!
 But you see what all this is dependent on, all this is dependent upon?
 Being able to get back to the point where it's da-da-da-da-da-da-da.
 Now that's what comes in meditation.
 Now don't misunderstand me if I say practice in meditation.
 Don't be in a state of expectation, working day after day to improve your meditation.
 Meditation doesn't like that, you just do it.
 But it is true that as time goes on and you are in that state of silence, you will see
 this quality of the world.
 Now the most difficult pains and problems to deal with are those that are monotonous,
 whereas you can see the possibility of a kind of ecstatic self-abandonment in a catastrophic
 agony.
 What really gets people down are those ones that drag on day after day after day after
 day, like having to lie with bedsores in a very uncomfortable situation, intraction or
 something of that kind, or just a perennial difficulty that drips, drips, drips, drips
 like the water torture every day.
 Now this is the kind of situation in which meditation shows its value, that you are increasingly
 in a state of consciousness where the world is babbling.
 Every one of us has something, you know, that we say we don't like to do.
 Washing dishes, doing accounts.
 But when you get into the meditation consciousness, you see that nothing is more important than
 anything else, or less important.
 There is no way of wasting time, because what is time for except to be wasted?
 And furthermore, you're accustomed now to sitting and doing nothing.
 I mean, meditation itself is the perfect waste of time.
 Out of Your Mind now continues with the next lecture from the Inevitable Ecstasy lecture
 series.
 Thank you.
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